On the Upward Way

Jerry McAfee was a Baptist preacher at New Salem Missionary Baptist Church and worked with gang members through The City Inc. and United for Peace in Minneapolis when this article appeared. Jim Wallis interviewed him at the Gang Summit.

- The Editors

Jim Wallis: A lot of people who don't understand what faith is about will be surprised at the role religion played at this summit.

Jerry McAfee: Of course! We are a spiritual people, and anytime we operate outside of that spirituality we're nothing. We learn especially from a Christian perspective that faith is the substance of things hoped for, and the evidence of things not seen.

My own definition of hope is the earnest expectation of God moving in the future. We see the other side of Jordan, the other side of the Red Sea--and not the circumstances or the water that hinder us from reaching our goal.

Wallis: At critical moments during the summit, when things were tense and tempers were on the edge, you stepped forward with a prayer or a song or a calm presence. You had a pastoral role here.

McAfee: Yeah, for many of these brothers I do. But there is an aura about people who are involved in struggle. Most of them are spiritually oriented people.

Sometimes prayer and song have a tendency to take those emotions down. And I just feel moved by the Spirit. If we don't do it now, emotions will carry us to a place we don't need to be. I don't think anyone would intentionally want that to happen, but our people are so locked up and hurting.

Wallis: What do you think comes out of this summit?

McAfee: From here, we need to continue to organize in our communities from a political standpoint, holding our representatives accountable. Those who will not be just and righteous need to be voted out. There's a song that says, "Faith, faith, just a little more faith. You don't need a whole lot, you just use what you got."

Sometimes we don't use what we have. From a political standpoint, we have to start using what we have.

We can't just network among the nations [gangs], we need foundations and programming. There are things that we do in Minneapolis that they may do in Kansas City or LA. We need to talk and exchange ideas. When we go to a new state to work on a truce, we should send a representative from across the country to help with training sessions.

It's a process. You don't just lay down your guns with no alternative plan. We have to have a process in place to show we care.

Wallis: What's the message you'd like to get across "out there"?

McAfee: I'm pressing on the upward way. New heights I'm gaining everyday. Still praying as I'm onward bound, Lord plant my feet on solid ground. Lord, lift me up and let me stand. My faith is on heaven's table and no higher place that I have found. Lord plant our feet on higher ground.

Wallis: You're a street pastor. You're in the community. What's the prophetic word you and these brothers and sisters have to the leadership of the churches of this country? White churches, black churches--the leadership that hasn't been responsive?

McAfee: Go ye, therefore, into all the world, and make disciples, baptizing them--which is identifying them with me--in the name of the Father, and the Son, and the Holy Spirit. We have to get about the mission of the great commission. The word for "church," ecclesia, means "called out." It has nothing to do with coming into a building. We've become so comfortable that we don't move outside of our buildings. That's insane.

Our church is located right in the heat of things. I stake that ground, that's my corner. I run that turf. The brothers, they know me, I know them. They eat at the church. They don't attend the church all the time, but they know the door is open. They come in with their hats on and their pants sagging because I've given them an invitation: You come through that door when you're ready.