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- A North Carolina Christian’s Response to Pastor Charles L. Worley
by Andrew Simpson 05-23-2012 - 10 reasons Why Men Should Not Be Ordained For Ministry
by Eugene Cho 04-30-2012 - A 'Bizarre and Peculiar' Ruling
by E.J. Dionne Jr. 06-01-2012 - What is the Chief Political Concern of the Bible?
by Tim Suttle 05-24-2012 - The Problem with Certitude
by Gary L. Tandy 05-25-2012 - Dear Pastor Charles Worley: We Condemn Your Words of Hatred and Cruelty. REPENT!
by Eugene Cho 05-23-2012 - The Gospel According to Lady Gaga
by Richard Beck 01-09-2012 - Rob Bell: 'Surrender the Outcomes'
by Cathleen Falsani 05-09-2012 - Jennifer Grant Asks 'What is an Evangelical?'
by Jennifer Grant 05-23-2012
by Karen Sue Smith 01-01-2012
Fifty years after Vatican II, will a new generation of lay Catholics lead prophetic change in the church and in the world?
by David Cortright 05-01-2010
... and make us all more secure. A pragmatic approach to nuclear disarmament.
by David Cortright 08-01-2006
Official rhetoric has helped fuel an escalation of tension between the United States and Iran. Do recent negotiations mark a change in direction, or just a temporary detour from the highway to military attack?
Comments
Re the War on Drugs.
We have a lot of slow learners. look at the onging corupting effects of Prohition re organised crime. I wonder some times if our ability to 'crucify' some of our fellow beings over manufactured issues is not part of our 'Look how Holy we are, and how Holy we are keeping our community!"
An issue with Pot is its ability to trigger psychotic problems. Sure some say it does not trigger such problems in those who do not any such potential to suffer. The triggering of Schizoid behavior at an earlier stage than otherwise does increase the mental health cost for the community. About 1200 years ago the use of Pot in China for recreation was suppressed because of the increased violent mental health problems in its users. The result was that the plant was used for all of it potential (available at the time) but 'recreational use' was suppressed.
Bit like the suppression of spiting in the street etc has been over the last 100 years here.
Understandably that Soccer Mums do not want their kids to blow their brains on pot. They have seen too much.
Of course legalizing drugs allows the managment of purity and the content of the various active ingredients that will reduce some of the associated problems and help balance the budget via taxation and in reductions in law enforcement needs. Also this would allow for better work on the safety of all of the various permutaions of street drugs being introduced.
Time to deal with reducing wants, not prohibition which enhances wants. Also we will need to be better at dealing with the mentally ill. A benefit will be less social unrest in supplying countries and less funds to finance the War in Afghanistan.
Some time ago when reading about the Pentecostal and Charismatic movements and how they developed, I was struck by an observation that God often bypasses groups by making their strengths of little effect. In that respect, doctrinal purity with enthusiastic existential worship. Source JI Packer.
I would not be surprised if the next awakening will follow this pattern. My humble suggestion is that it could be long on relationships and short on organisational strengths and political connections with an emphasis on deeply honest relationships before God. Gender roles will be questioned if they get in the way of recognising equality before God.
With out a move by God, the Church in the West has a poor future.
Some time ago when reading about the Pentecostal and Charismatic movements and how they developed, I was struck by an observation that God often bypasses groups by making their strengths of little effect. In that respect, doctrinal purity with enthusiastic existential worship. Source JI Packer.
I would not be surprised if the next awakening will follow this pattern. My humble suggestion is that it could be long on relationships and short on organisational strengths and political connections with and emphasis on deeply honest relationships before God. Gender roles will be questioned if they get in the way of recognising equality before God.
With out a move by God, the Church in the West has a poor future.
I do not agree with the concept that public servants do not generate benefit to the community. Having worked for 3 different Australian public services (Feds and 2 for states) and 3 private companies, plus observing at close hand several multinationals I would strongly suggest that the so called efficiencies of private bureaucracies is a corrosive myth created by selfish persons whose parentage is questionable. Who regard the common good as an area to privatise without adequate compensation for the rest of society? We used to call them bandits or War Lords or the arestorcracy.
To suggest that public servants do not require any form of joint representation to protect individuals or groups from unequable treatment is destructive. How else can you protect your selves from industrial sociopaths in senior management positions etc?
Like wise to claim that the benefits paid should be less than equivalent work in the private sphere is an appeal to reinstitute slavery.
To suggest that there is no benefit for public servants as there is no profit as you seem to define it is nonsense. Just look at the problems if you do not have reasonable management of such things as pharmaceutical standards for drugs, or road rules. The public service is to function where there is an over whelming need for common good and critical market failure, or unbiased administration or regulation.
For example, in my work with an herbicide I demonstrated that its use at 21 days after sowing compared with the normal farmer use of 28 to 40 days was substantual So much so the gains for the States farmers in one cropping season was greater thatn the cost of my whole career including my education and pension. No more chemical was used, just used better. Yet no finacial gains to the bottom line the Department or anything additional for myself or the project group. I did what I was paid for. Just better returns for the farmer. Yes the manufacturer then validated my work, and promoted the idea strongly, but only after I demonstrated it and extended it to the farming community first.
If you are of the view that public servants do not deserve similar conditions as to private workers and blame the concept of unionisation for poor out comes, try looking at management. For example German car manufacturers produce better cars at twice the rate of American car manufacturers’ for the same number or workers. Yes they pay more too. With the interaction of industrial democracy, unions and management their systems out performs US confrontational systems.
Confrontational approaches do not work with educated people. However big business and big unions is a recipe for poor outcomes.
Likewise, in the more professional sections of the public service, eg teachers, there is considerable unpaid over time worked.
From what I see from here is that the public servants are the last US group of workers to have their incomes/benefits reduced and to attack them for defending this is to ignore the decline of the US Workers position compares to their predecessors.
Time for the same effort to be put into reviewing the financial and banking industry management.
I read the comments above with a heavy heart. I hope things continue OK for you, Scat.
I wonder as an outsider with heritage of the USA, just how the population of what was one of the most innovative nations on earth has been lead to be in such a situation?
On my computer desk are a number of medical bills incurred over the last 6 months by my wife who has been to 5 specialists for a series of examinations and tests. Finally the conclusion is the very early stages of Parkinson's disease. We now also have a good idea of what she is not suffering from as well.
The accounts have been covered largely by the Medicare system here, backed up where appropriate by our private hospital insurance policy( $1,100/year covers many things including ambulances, hospital care and subsidies optical, dental etc. It also gets one into private hospitals where there are waiting lists faster). Net amounts paid out by us is about 15% total. We are pensioners so our pharmaceuticals are also low. Mostly about $5.50/script.
Similar for my 100 year old father. 2 recent trips to hospital blood transfusions, test etc, and transfers. Cost to us, not much < $30/trip.
Australians usually do not go bankrupt over essential medical bills. Those without private cover may wait a bit for non essential work. That is not good.
As far as the total cost/head Australians are paying directly and indirectly via the taxation system is concerned, is about 35% that of the USA and using the gauge of world rankings for life expectancies we are only 9 or 10 compared with about about 63ed in the world or so. That suggests for a nation which prides itself on its commercial brilliance, a rather poor situation.
Does anyone know or care? It seems that "I am OK, I don't care about anyone else. Let them pay, we cannot organize a low cost blanket scheme, it might help the undeserving (... fill in with the current despised group - color, poor, gays, illegals - etc.") is the rule. Can't regulate the transferring of funds from the consumer to private industry in an unequal situation. Try negotiating lower costs on say pharmaceuticals.
Justice for the poor in this case could actually be cheaper for All. I guess the 99% is speaking out the voiceless.
Mmm... the Golden Rule - "He who has the Gold, makes the rules."
If an organization receives any monies from the State then it is not independent of external control but must acknowledge the requirements imposed for the privilege of receiving such funds. Should it be a right of such organizations to withhold certain other wise routine entitlements from staff who do not necessarily accept the religious views of the organization for which they work?
Catholics and contraception - overall there seems to be a huge divide between what the leaders are saying and of the behavior of the laity. A house divided can not stand.
Just what are the real issues here?
Bit of a problem this. Christ healed lepers and then told them to present themselves to the Priests of the day to verify the healing. How many faith healers do that today and report back to the group some time afterwards? Remember that placebos work well in some situations.
Truth in advertizing is a reasonable principal.
Yet to claim that God want's to heal You and it does not happen, what then? We can then blame the victim as it is their fault that they have not been healed. Yet we are also told that it is our unbelief which blocks God's work. This may be true, but also is also an out which results in blaming the victim. Works great with some one who is some what mentally ill. That does not help their mental stability. Been there done and got the frustration when treating the walking wounded.
The health wealth and prosperity Gospel is at least a con to assist the promotion of some, and at worst a serious heresy. I would suggest that particular case is a backlash against extremes. If you make claims which cannot be verified, do not be surprised if regulators start complaining.
Same thing needs to be done for a lot of alternative medicine claims. Prove it or shut up. The term 'snake oil' comes to mind. However, by using the right words, one should be able to talk freely about God's healing without being closed down.
I was listening to a note on my radio (ABC RN National, This Day Tonight, Australia) tonight re this issue. It was suggested that the use of abortion and women's health issues to score political points has reached its use by date in the USA.
It will be interesting to see if the prediction is accurate. It is based on the rapid reversal of the decision to withhold funding of PP.
I would suggest having skimmed through the comments above that this issue has been driven to far into a binary situation. The general population is starting to revolt from the hard line positions into which it has been forced.
Biology is not binary, but one tends to see variation across a general population. To make a statement that fertilized eggs are persons is less sound when it could be suggested that God does not. Otherwise why so many abort? Faults occur from faulty chromosomes in the egg and sperm, to the odd cosmic ray damaging the DNA as it is dividing for the first time, plus all of the chemicals/viruses/diseases etc to which we are continually subjected to. Many PhD's there.
Some time ago a paper appeared in Christianity Today which suggested in the light of uncertainty as raised above that perhaps the formation and circulation of blood could be used as one such marker. I would suggest that the detection of brain waves in a coherent patterns could be another.
Just what is the situation of an adult who has been rendered brain dead? Are they a fully living functioning person or has the person left the building? Not easy to turn off life support is it, but???
I would also suggest that the Biblical writers were not as aware of the fine detail of the development of the fertilized egg into a functioning person as we are. So we have got to be careful not to miss use their insights in this area today. Likewise there is still much to tease out. (For those discussing inerrancy, do the thought experiment of trying to explain how DNA encodes genetic information say to Issiah or Job? I would suggest that the vocabulary available would make the coherent transmission of the concepts extremely difficult.)
Amen Jennifer.
Its very obvious from outside, that the political debates and point scoring is getting extremely trivial. This suggests that the differences between the parties is getting fairly trivial, and the underlying world views have reached their use by date. As it is here, selfish posturing over point scoring without dealing with what is important for the community and for the grand children. Utter stupidity.
I feel that the Church needs a major reformation along the lines of there are no differences between any humans before God. This includes any exceptionalism on the bases of class or ethnic heritage.
Most economists would suggest that labour shortages in a particular industry usually indicates that the wages in that industry are not sufficient to attract workers for those jobs. As I suggested above, the returns to farmers do not allow this to happen.
Having worked in reviewing training courses for Ag. workers here, the broad acre farmers wanted a skill base which will earn $Au125,000-150,000/year in the mines for a 52 week - less holidays etc year fly in fly out, for a 4 - 5 month year at a rate of only about 25- 30% as much for casual work. No way could they compete. Operating big equipment demands skill.
To abuse workers via implied or actual class distinctions (racism etc), rough working conditions and poor living conditions further exasperates this problem.
Organised labour may be part of the solution, but not if it is regarded by the employers as the Devil incarnate, but if it is used to create better returns down the 'food chain', ie questioning the profits made.
It is not for nothing that the Australian Wheat Boards was targeted by US companies and destroyed, and now the Canadian Wheat board is as well. If we get rid of grower control in the market, we can push the returns to them lower.
Mmm... in most famines the rich do not starve. The current poster child for this is the new leader of North Korea.
A famine is where there are large numbers of people who do not have access to sufficient food to live. This may be absolute lack of, best seen in the pictures of dead and dying stock in rangelands where there is no feed visible. Or they can be engineered - explore Stalin’s rule in the old USSR as just one of a long list of recent horrible examples. If people cannot earn sufficient funds to survive, how do they?
It is interesting that the major famine in China during the mid late 1930's probably as much as anything allowed Mao to be successful. If you do not look after your people, your children may be stood against the wall and shot.
The origin of the Australian national song "Waltzing Matilda" was during the period of conflict between the shearers and other agricultural workers with the ‘landed gentry’ (Squatters) where the shearers fought for a fair return.
It would seem that there is a need for a similar labour movement in US Agriculture to achieve similar changes. Sure this would cause cost increase up the system, but the take by the big supermarkets needs pruning a bit. You may have to tighten up on the laws re the misuse of guns a bit as well.
Time for the full implementation of the full equality of humans before God.
Its time for a Reformation. There is no point in the Faithful being ‘faithful to the way things were done yesterday’. (Packer) The past as some have said ‘is another place’. The Church tends to reflect the culture in which it lives. Time for some good critique of just how ‘Wall St’ and entertainment focused it has become.
If the Gospel is redemptive, why are we not at least providing another conversation re the future of our culture/civilization? Not just the cop out that it will all be destroyed shortly.
One which reflects the truth that ALL humans are equally precious before God. Not just embryos – but it’s too bad to have children/pregnant women killed by miss directed drones. That has turned a blind eye to the exploitation of refugees - economic or political because they are ‘non’ citizens? That has not even questioned the removal of effective Habeas Corpus in the interests of National Security. And of course does not question the damage to our generation from unrestrained ‘fast food’ promotion, to say nothing of climate change and other ecological issues.
I know it easy to ask questions and kick the popular issues, but where are the fruits of our redemption?
Today a report on the ABC (Australia!) here summarized the difficult issues involved. For the Big Picture not just the USA see "Rise of unsafe abortions 'deeply disturbing'" on http://www.abc.net.au/news/2012-01-19/rise-of-unsafe-abortions-27deeply-... or the original paper on the Lancet. Text of paper is included on the ABC Website.
Original Research Article in The Lancet – Author Version Induced abortion: incidence and trends worldwide from 1995 to 2008 *G Sedgh ScD, S Singh PhD, S K Henshaw PhD, A Bankole PhD: Guttmacher Institute, New York, NY USA I H Shah PhD, E Åhman MA: World Health Organization, Geneva, Switzerland Published online January,19th,2012 DOI:10.1016/S0140 ‐ 6736 (11) 61786 ‐ 8 Abstract available on The Lancet Web site.
I think that like the war on drugs, we need to carefully re examine just what is happening and acknowledge that restrictions to safe abortion will kill more women. If you want to reduce abortions make a wide range of contraception systems plus education available.
As for nations like Holland and Portugal, removing penalties for drug use has reduced the numbers of users, so reducing the numbers of unplanned pregnancies will reduce the numbers of abortions. Time to get real and not deny human instincts. The greatest cause of death in women 16 to 45 yrs, in the South Pacific are botched abortions.
To say that we as a community can legally stop all this by banning abortions is to deny the nature of our humanness. Harm minimization is needed. You will need good sex education in the community as well. Just hidding behind the statement that sex education increases inappropiate ie out of marrage 'sexual activity', suggests a simplistic attitude. The media does not tell us why sex and its importance in stable relationships.
I find it interesting that the Puritans seem to have been the people who rescued the idea that Sex is a good given gift and should be used properly. The concept of romantic love was assisted by this insight. Time to stop being judgmental, that is God's prerogative, but look at how best to reduce harm and trauma all round.
Note again - reference above is to the Australian Broadcast Commission website, not the ABC of the USA. I have had a few snide remarks in the past about the ABC as people did not read the address properly and see the '.au' at the end.
Cheers All.
Good paper.
While this year has been a bit damper, climate change has reduced the rainfall over the SW of Australia since the mid 70's including Perth by about 20%. This makes farming more difficult, as well as reducing water inflows into our water supply.
Like wise very recent modeling/field research has suggested the the burning practices of the Australian Aborigine over the last 70 odd thousand years or so has changed the monsoon patterns for the North of Australia. Yet big coal/oil tells us that human activity cannot change the climate.
I am thinking that its time for another Reformation in Christianity.
Time to fully develop the ideas of ALL are equal before God and that there is no exceptionalism for any humans before God.
Time to review the attitudes to gender roles.
Time for the Church to be de Imperialized.
Time to remember that God Created all of our Universe so how do we repect / use / exist in it. Excuses that it all will be destroyed in the end times are to be seen for what they are, an excuse for promoting ignorance on the grounds that time is short so have no time to encourage learning and understanding. 'Got to save Souls' - these attitudes are not working in Australia, people are staying away in droves.
Time to ditch the Desert fathers in favour of the Celtic Monks who lived in the Forests/ on the Coast as they had a more encompassing view on Creation.
Time to realize that organisations such as companies, religious groups and governments etc, are the servants of humanity, not their owners.
And so much more.
So where to nail the Theses?
I support Squeaky’s comments especially the issue of providing feed back if there is a reply to your comment.
I feel that in changing to the current format you have destroyed the intimacy and strenght of the community.
The discus format does stimulate allot of activity - see Al Jazerra - English (that is if it is available in the USA)
Hello Willow and other occasional visitors.
Welcome
A problem here is that if you are convinced that you are right, any one who is of an alternative view is necessarily wrong. Too much binary thinking. This is made worse by the use of terms such as 'socialism' which seems to mean from the context the command economy such as North Korea or the height of Pol Pot, rather than say the Scandinavian countries. The use of variable meanings also make life difficult for those looking in from other cultures like myself.
This approach does not bode well when used in business or social meetings at Church, work, business or government negotiations or in the public arena. Consensus is not easily reached, so the unity is split.
For practical results, look at the much higher productivity per worker in German car factories cf US factories.
Personally I suggest that this is in part due to the over indulgence of exceptional-ism to which the USA is prone, plus a lack of world travel. Some commentators here also suggest that this is a result of the downgrading of the education system. Looking at the education scores out of China, the USA has problems coming. As I indicated above, I also consider that News Ltd is more than some what part of the problem.
I would suggest that the revelations in the various Parliamentary enquiries in Britain of machinations of News Ltd subsidiaries places the credibility of the whole organisation at -5 out of 10. One could suggest that Fox is tainted as well. Same owner. As an Australian, I have watched the effect of News in my society and it is not good for the poor/powerless or any one not in the big end of town. It is not noted for promoting the sacred here.
Remember that Murdock’s father was partially responsible for WW2 as he pushed for bigger reparations by Germany which helped pave the way for Hitler. I am not suggesting that that is what he foresaw or wanted, but the short sighted immediate greed did not allow for a proper recovery of that nation. Likewise with the current Anti Global warming campaign by News.
I would not think that is a problem, as the 1% has already rorted the system.
i would strongly suggest that you spend some time taking with the street people in a place like Calcutta. I can arrange for guides, its safe, but get your shots first and take your anti malarias, and we d not eat cold cooked food, off the street or drink from bottles/cans we have not opened. The issue is after one recovers from the culture shock, "Why is it So?" then what to do about it.
Corruption in Greece, India and now in the USA where tax avoidance is beginning to reach critical levels, is the biggest issue. How come GE or Mobil Oil pays no tax?
The description 'tooheavenly/spiritually minded, no earthly good' summarises this well.
I also get some what concerned where there is a certain pride expressed the claims of total incompetence of simple practical processes. Eg changing an accessible simple light bulb. Bit like the old Chinese gentlemen I saw in a park when young in Shangha1 in 1949 whose fingernails were at least 12 inches long. Status sign of not doing any physical or manual work. I wonder what happened to his class after the Red Army arrived.
We should be balanced and encourage skills in all categories.
I am not surprised that there is a problem in handing the Church on to the next generation. That the Church in the USA does not seem to have made any complaint re the descent into the fascist state which seems to be developing with the ability of the military to detain any one for as long as deemed necessary with out recourse to habeas corpus indicates that it has lost touch with its heritage from the 1st 3 centuries. Then it had to deal with the Roman Empire and it was very much the underdog.
At a time where so much has been transferred from the less well off to the most well off with even approval of the tactics used by many of the Churched and the consequence of the philosophies that has generated this should we be surprised?. To declare that even when bankrupt, educational debts cannot be escaped seems to me to be a huge transfer of rights to the holder of the debit. I did not think slavery had been approved.
Are not Christians all equal before God, so why are there any racial issues with in the community that has not been questioned. Especially within Gods Community? Our loyalty transcends family, clan, tribe, ethic group, social class and nation state. Not surprised that the young are leaving.
Up the next reformation!
In a Western World dominated by News LTD I take exception that truth is only found to the right of the MSNBC on the USA TV system and by implication not to be found elsewhere in the world. Try Al Jazeera English, the BBC, The ABC - that is the Australian Broadcasting Corperation, et al for a different view of the world. Their Web sites are also quite good. The USA is not the only game in town.
To help the poor and to give is commendable and as James suggests is a consequence of being a Christian. I also ask “Why it is So that the poor pay more and work harder?” Or ‘why is there so much upper class socialism (privatize profits and socialise the losses)?’ Some would suggest that makes me a communist. I retort with the comment, “So? Show me your justice.”
By implication, any thing which is placed in the way of any person that prevents them from reaching their full potential is not good. To quote James, to wish them well and do nothing to assist is worse than ignoring such a person.
Implied in many blogs here where there is an attempt to separate personal activities in giving alms to from working to ensure that the community in which you live to take action to provide solutions. Such as summarized in the statement "taxes are theft”. For example, requesting banks etc to provide simple no fee bank accounts for all, even if there may not be any deposits in there for most of the time, allows for people to cash cheques without being ripped off by the weekend lenders. Added cost, yes, but would this not be payment for the privilege of being licensed to do business in the community? We have had that problem of cheques being cashed for much less than 100% of value where no banks exist in our outback. See the history of the Grameen Bank in Bangladesh.
With out any social contract, is it Ok for me to use high mercury coal and poison everyone down wind?
Not sure devolving the government will assist in managing huge corporations or protecting the 99%. Look at any 3ed world situation with oil etc. The locals get ripped off every time.
We have problems in Australia with that. A previous prime minister tried to tax very profitable out fits and was rolled.
Ending / reducing fascism - where corporations effectively control government is needed. Not sure that the myth of big government is not just a cover to allow even more fascist behaviour divert questioning from the role of the corporate sector over the rest of the community.
Had the 7.7 trill been used to acquire the ownership of the firms in trouble, there could be some prospect of profits at the end of the scheme as the shares are sold off again. Of course this also would have allowed for careful investigation of any illegal activity as the executives would have been escorted from their offices empty handed. Meanwhile, as the prime share holder, the people could ensure that excesses are kept in check.
Incidentally, the Dutch taxed all bonuses at 100% for any firms which received any government assistance. Good vote buyer.
It would seem that we have forgotten the lessons of history in as much as checks and balances are needed to protect the exploited.
Look into the history of issues such as the 8 hour day.
A problem going on here is the fly in fly out work regimes which while well remunerated is systematically driving wedges in the community by splitting families in the interest of economic efficiencies.
The triple bottom line includes a dividend to the public good and to realize the cost of disrupted cultures.
Oops sorry - get a better system please.